I'm listening to madonna. I'm scared of ridiculous things like spiders. I'm attracted to men. I'm a bitch. I apparently walk effeminately, too. I've never even touched a metal/rock CD, and don't think I ever will. I don't like sports. The majority of my close friends as a kid were girls, and the only reason they aren't now is because I go to an all boys school. I like writing poetry, and I like can appreciate art. I like the colour purple. I have emotions, and when I feel them, I'll show them. I want to perform on a proffessional level, singing. I want to learn how to dance. I'm vain, and I would wear something from the female side of a shop if I thought it would work on me. I don't really play video games, particularly the violent, 'cool', manly ones like COD etc. I never want to see a horror film in my life, because I don't see any appeal in scaring the crap out of myself. My favourite film is probably Mean Girls, and I like those sort of films.

I think pride in your 'manliness' is the stupidest thing ever - the only thing that actually makes you a man is whether or not you have a *****.

Acting manly or tough doesn't actually make you strong. I'm not a weak person. I have a hellova lot of self-confidence now, and I'm capable to pull through everything I've been through easily on most points soon. I'm a bitch - I have the strength to tell people, people I don't really know or my friends, what I think of them, without really thinking about it, even if its going to hurt them. I say things that hurt my friends sometimes deliberately to get them to act the way I want, too. I'm crap at physical activities, but I don't want to be good at them. I want to be and am strong at different things.

If you just cave in to doing things, things you don't particularly want to do, it doesn't make you strong and manly. It makes you weak, for succumbing to peer pressure.

@Krisp: You're not fug :|

I know what you mean though, IX, and you to an extent too, Krisp; for most of my life I was much more like a guy than like a girl. Whenever we went shopping or on vacation as a family, I'd prefer to spend time with my dad and my brother instead of with my mom and sister. They looked at cooler things, went on cooler rides and listened to better music.

I've become the total opposite now though. I'm vain and I love shopping and my room is almost entirely pink.

Good for you for not caring though, IX :)

well let's see. I had the longest hair in school until I got it cut last Saturday. I've never played a team sport in my life. I play the clarinet, a traditionally feminine instrument. I sometimes cry during films, TV shows or even books. I even set my gender icon to female on the forum because it's the cool thing to do.

I'm not very good at this 'man' thing, am I?

All I have to say is who gives a frak about manly or feminine. a wise man once told me that "You have to know your strengths and weaknesses." My point is that if you arn't strong, or athletic, or anything of that nature, you shouldn't care that much about it.

Take me for example: I'm a short, weak nerd who would rather watch Star Trek all day than talking to my "friends". I acctually wish that the world of Star Trek was real, because people in that galaxy are judged not on their manliness, but on their knowledge. I have never succeeded at a team sport, and the only sport I was ever good at is Taekwondo, as it is a fighting style that isn't about strength. I am one of the smartest kids in the GIFTED program at my school, and I'm the only one who acctually cares about my education. I focus on my strengths, my smarts, and not my weaknesses.

So stop whining about what you think about yourselves!

Some of you may be surprised to find out that I'm not a genetic guy. :I

I'm a whopping 5'6" and 136lbs. I can only lift about 10lbs more than my own weight and can barely do a single pull-up. I love fruity drinks and smells and wouldn't come withing 10 feet of drinking a soda, coffee, or taquilla. I watch what I eat and take daily womens multi-vitamins and fish oils. I saw "Aww! That's cute!" and "That's....lovely..." around almost any crowd. Tap me on the ass and I'll swing a punch right to your gut. I write my girlfriend love letters and dress up for her amongst countless other things.

Even after all of that, my girlfriend still calls me "manly" and the greatest guy she's ever met. :3
So I think being manly is a relatively vague term. It can be used to describe physique or attitude and I believe my girlfriend means in both ways to some extent. :/

(here's a pic of me) http://uchiha-tracker.deviantart.com/gallery/#/d2oickc
I have a bleached spot in my hair, but it's hard to see. :I

Manliness is all about the attitude - http://www.gametrailers.com/user-movie/ ... man/222975

Likes and dislikes for random things and concepts, physical build and appearance, hobbies and interests do not make a man.

I'm tall and thin with no upper body strength. I like to watch sports but not play them. I hate being outside and actually working the land in any way. I'll always resort to outsmarting someone than attempting to physically beat an opponent, because there's little chance of success in the latter. Most of my friends have always been girls. While I enjoy a good beer, I'm just as likely to order a raspberry margarita or something similar. I still consider myself plenty manly despite it.

I have a girly high voice, especially compared to many of my friends. I have a substantial amount of brute strength, but that's only because I'm very large and stocky. I'm no good at sports and I can kick my leg over my head without injuring myself. I'm very flexible, especially for a big, fat 17 year old male. I can do a flawless "gay" lisp and everyone says I would make an "excellent" gay guy, whatever that means. I've never had a girlfriend although I've been madly in love with two girls who have both broken my heart. I'm very sensitive about stupid things and often cry myself to sleep thinking of just where I went wrong in my love life. My best friend is a girl whom I am head-over-heels in love with, but she sees nothing in me because of who and what I am. In fact, she's commented on how one of my friends is "the manliest nerd she's ever seen." Of course, this sparked my paranoia and now he's a threat.

I'm quite a jealous and vindictive drama-queen. A girl did a tarot reading for me once and 4 of the 5 cards she picked happened to be the most powerful feminine cards in the deck.

I'm prefectly fine with my own level of masculinity, but when compared to others it can really get to me, especially when the comparisons are made by females I happen to enjoy being around. I'm more of a "gay best friend who isn't gay" than any sort of dating or lovable entity.

So, as you can see you're in good company! As far as everybody is concerned all preconcieved notions about men and women are just stereotypes...

Stereotypes are FTL.

Manly or feminine. Like sports or don't. Doesn't really matter much in the end. What is important is that you learn who you are. Sometimes the learning part of that is the most painful (as many of us have learned). But find who you really are, accept that and don't try to be something you're not and you'll be happier. You'll make some new friends along the way - you'll lose some people who probably weren't real friends to begin with, but that's okay. Your real friends will (and probably already have) accepted you for who you are - the rest are just excess baggage.

Will you be happy all the time, I wouldn't think so and I wouldn't want to be that person - I think it would be boring. Am I really one to talk, am I perfect? Hardly. However, I'm pretty much okay with who I am most of the time. For most of us, life is a seemingly long journey of discovery - once we discover who we are, we can move on to discovering lots of other new and exciting things. Who knows, once you start accepting who you are, you may find out that you're a pretty good person.

As for me, I'm a guy for sure and I like girls. But I enjoy cooking. I like shooting and can hunt to put food on the table if I have too, but buying a steak is a hell of a lot easier than killing an elk, cleaning it, dragging it back home, cutting it up and storing the meat and tanning the hide. Believe me - hunting is a LOT of work. I like some shoot-em-up games (still enjoy the original "Doom" and "Doom II"), but I also really enjoy "Bookworm" and the Nancy Drew games. I sometimes enjoy watching sports or racing, but usually get bored with it fairly quickly (very little, if any, intellectual stimulation). And my all-time favorite game is chess.

I'm just me.

Oh, and Krisp . . . I think you're cool. I dig strong girls.

If there were a gender scale, one end being bitch and the other being dick, I would be the genderless median.

Just be yourself, there's nothing wrong with having people not all be exactly the same. Very rarely do I see someone who fits the perfect stereotype of their gender, and when I do, it's usually so obvious they're faking it it isn't even funny. There are ~6.8 billion people in the world, and you're not going to be able to please all of them ever, so I wouldn't worry about trying to fit the mold that only some of these people have set up/care about.

ugh....I'm gonna make some people hate me XD

how do I put this.....I'm Arabic, so instead of using the word "manly" which I guess implies the stereotypical image of a hairy guy in a checkered shirt drinking beer from a mason jar and scratching his armpits, I'm going to use a very special word to me, which is Zalameh (a man).

a lot of people here misinterpret the word Zalameh as the need to be tough, to fight people for looking at you funny, for smoking, drinking, being in gangs etc. but no, I was taught that a real Zalameh is a person who knows how to recognize his responsibilities to his family and country, to defend justice, defend his home, turn the other cheeck in certain cases, and whack like a hammer in others, being a Zalameh is being there for others, putting them before you, being strong when your loved ones are weak.....a Palestinian standing in front of an Israeli tank with a stone and saying "no, I will not fall, I am immortal in this life and the next". knowing your duty and having the determiniation to fulfill it no matter what it costs, least of which your life.

I dunno IX, I know you, I don't think you could fight for your country, I don't think you could be the head of a household, I don't know if you can stand up and defend the honour of yourself or your family through physical conferontation, and I certainly don't know whether you recognize what's important in life....you said you tell people how you feel about them whether you know them or not, I guess I'm doing the same.

well i'm 15 and I guess at my school i'm nowhere near the picture of "manliness" i've been called gay countless times for not being like most of the guys here. i don't play sports, in gym i'm the kid who just kind of stands there cause i suck at catching a football. lol. but i accept it. i laugh about it. my gym coach even admires how i stand up to the guys thinking i'm not manly and constantly drilling me about how i suck at sports, didn't even report me when i told them all to "F*** OFF AND SUCK A D***" (but some students did, douchebags). but im not that strong. rather than playing sports i'd rather be out just walking around town with my friends finding things to do. i play pokemon, and surprisingly i know more kids older than me who play it then people in my grade. my dad tells me how i need to put on more muscle and it frustrates me how even my own dad criticizes me, but whatever. it's why i like to be with my mom most of the time, shes funner anyways, he doesn't talk much. Although the guys call me gay, i have a girlfriend, who likes the fact that i'm not a stereotypical male. she tends to stick up for me too, even when i'm sticking up for myself already. so i guess thats about it... lol.

I find the concept of masculinity to be incorrectly attached to sexual identity a lot. An effeminate man is often assumed to be gay even though a pretty big chunk of the gay community is not only not effeminate, but also masculine in the conventional sense.

Anyways, I find typical gender expectations to be pretty shallow and facetious, as do a lot of people even if they aren't in any self-identified "counter-culture" group. I have never played a sport at school and I never will, and the same goes for a lot of my friends (both male and female). Most of my male friends who have played a sport chose to play Tennis, which (while it is a respectable sport and if I HAD to take a sport it would definitely be tennis. I think I would enjoy it, and I have played it casually in the past) isn't really in the same "masculinity league" as football etc. A lot of my friends also do swimming, which is largely the same thing. I enjoy musical theater, I wouldn't call it a dream job but I would like to play an instrument in a pit band for a musical; I enjoy the stress level and behind the scenes nature of such a job. Also, I might attend Sarah Lawrence...but that decision is still a long long way away.

at 17 im 6 foot 1inch 205ish pounds and i work out daily.

I was born in St. Petersburg, Russia and am know for being aggressive allot of my friends call me the Russian.

I'm loyal to friends and am gallant to all girls but my favorite sport is football (american) because a sport where you can legally beat the crap out of people is allot of fun.

I shave my head (and everything but my eyebrows-even though I'm blonde), and take "manliness" to a new level.

With that said- i appreciate arts and am probably more sensitive than most people realize but in no way am i a little puss.

I started Pokemon when i was little and i kept playing and it led me here.

Its a good way for me to relieve stress after homework and practice.

I think guys should try to be masculine...

all i have to say is i really dont care much if guys are masculine or not, actually i kind of dislike that whole big macho masculine thing, and im a girl. I sometimes think i have kind of a masculine additude versus a feminine one and i honestly prefer this. I could never be a complete girly girl ever. I have distaste for many feminine things. I like makeup but am not obsesssed with it and i barely wear it. I barely file/ manicure my nails. I dont shop for clothes very often cause i hate clothes shopping. I wish i could be strong, play sports, stuff like that but i dont really have the body for that. I basically try hard to defy all female stereotypes cause i dont believe in them.

Try Hockey. There are a lot of fights on the ice.

I wouldn't fight for my country, because I don't have pride in my country, anymore than I have pride in anything I've directly inherited - where I come from, the wealth of my family, the school I go to, my gender - I only have pride in the things I have achieved myself, and even that is minimal; I always think I could do better, and I strive to do better next time.

I don't want a family/household in the sense of children, because of the career path I've chosen for myself, and because I don't really want to be a parent, or at least, not at this point in time. I don't like the idea of 'managing your household' though, you can't control other peoples lives. I don't believe you should teach your children 'life lessons', show them life isn't fair, because they have to, and will, work it out themselves. I don't believe you should tell your children what to do either, they should once again make their own decisions. I respect my parents, but I've never actually conformed to what they want me to do because they've wanted me to do it, and I've never accepted they've had authority over me.

I give my best shot to defend anyone who's unfairly attacked verbally, and I've gone against friends/family to protect people I think have been unfairly treated too. I don't understand 'honour' anymore than pride, but I will defend a person. I can't physically harm people really, and it would be stupid to try, although I have done so a couple of times. I tend to stick to verbal abuse, which honestly, generally has more of an effect in my opinion. I can ignore a joke, but if someone was to try to do something to one of my sisters, if it was to an extreme extent, I could pull a trigger on a gun and not give it a second thought. I figured a while back I have the mental capacity to kill someone. But I couldn't do it for 'my country', because I think a life is worth adapting cultures etc.

I reckognise what's important in life - and it isn't pride. I believe questioning these things is a stronger quality, and I take a lot more to people who don't just stick to doing what they're told. I only do things I want to do, feel I should do, and feel that I or someone else will benefit from. I care about other people a lot - I think that the most important thing in life is the impact you make on other people, and the effect you have in their lives.

I think your pride is a major weakness, not a strength. You should only ever be proud of your own achievements, because everything else has nothing to do with you personally really.

And more importantly, your gender has nothing to with these traits/ideas. And the idea you have pride in your 'manliness' suggests you think men are superior, which is something we supposably got past 60 years ago. Its a primitive idea, and completely ridiculous.

If I were to fight for my country, then it would be behind the front lines, like in Mash. I can't kill. It's not that I don't have the physical capacity or the smarts to kill (smarts being knowing how and where to hit someone) it's the mental capacity. If I were to kill anything other than an insect, than I would feel like crap. After all, I'm not a Klingon!

because you don't understand pride and honour, that means that they don't exist?

I like to think that there's something bigger in life, forget god, I'm not talking about that, I'm talking about living life believing in something that will keep you disciplined and geniunly make you feel that your life was worth something on your deathbed.....heck people can make money, have sex their whole lives but I don't think that on theor deathbed, it's really something to show for themeselves. you need to leave behind a lineage, a legacy, something for your grandkids to strive to live up to. ever see Knights Tale? when they were waiting to arrest William at the list, and he refused to run, that's what a man is.

let's see how my trying to be a "man" affects how I live and treat people, I take responsibility, I can't let an older person in my family carry something heavy, I run and take it off their hands so they can relax. I have initiative, I try to do the right thing no matter how tough because I know it's right and what a real man would do. I gallant with women, men are made to serve women and do all the hard labour for them, I always jump to open doors for women, I don't look at girls innapropriately, and I don't even I don't think about girls in a wrong way...usually . fearlessness, I'm not afraid of putting myself in danger when it means sparing other people from harm, and like I said, I wouldn't hesitate to fight if a war broke out in my country, maybe you would because you don't love your country, but my country is the dearest thing to me, and if you don't have pride in the place you come from then sir, you aren't really alive.

To some people, this might be service to one country, to honor and care for his family, or to fight for worldly causes such as starvation or an illness. Ultimately, what a man chooses to devote his life to does not define his masculinity. Chivalry, mensch, Zalameh: whatever word one may use to represent gentlemen or a man of honor, each culture holds a separate ideal. What one might believe to be essential may not be to true to someone else. While pride in nationality or race is important to some people, others can find it hard to identify with a young or miscegenated nation or something they have animosity towards. In what way are either of these beliefs wrong?

But this simply shows that a man and the conventions that delineate his masculinity are subjective. How one behaves and appears does not always illustrate how he views himself. We can't confine others and ourselves to how a single person or a collective culture says we should. We are who we say we are and what we believe to be.

I dunno Zombie, I know you, I don't think you understand this, I don't think you could ever believe that there is more than one right answer because you tell people what's important and what it means to be alive, I don't think you could grasp the concept that different cultures exist and learn to respect them, you pretty much display your ignorance by overgeneralizing life and calling people out pretending like you know them, I guess I'm doing the same.

haha, it's certainly is a fine day when someone accuses me of ignorance, or suggests that I have trouble understanding the big picture. XD



you are doing that, you even said "I know you".....and I've done what? posted like....3 times in the past 12 months? the fact of the matter is that all of us think that we know how other people think, and sometimes we're right, and other people think they know how we think, nobody is too complicated to read. you think I believe that life has one answer, you don't know me at all, I'm an avid believer that there is no such thing as truth, nothing is permanant, and everything we know or think we know is in flux. I understand other cultures and ideals, I have genuine respect for most cultures and religions and always try to look at things from theor points of veiw, and I generally succeed.

what I'm doing here is showing IX what it means to me to be a man, how it enriches my life and makes me a better person, how I believe there are certain things in this life that are worth living for and worth dying for. we live in an age where religion has deteriorated and has become no longer a truth, but pride and honour are the one thing they can't take away from me, I just don't see the point of living without having something to live for, is that so wrong? I didn't realize that some sense of direction undermined the beliefs and cultures of others.