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Platinum's Impact on the Metagame
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Author:  Peanut-Lover [ Wed Sep 10, 2008 6:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Platinum's Impact on the Metagame
Okay, just like Emerald introduced new things to the Advanced metagame (and subsequently oft-overlooked XD), Platinum hs added alot as well...


Recent developments from Smogon's Shoddy Servers (past month): Garchomp and Deoxys not allowed in standard play
This led to a rise in Scarf Heatran, and bulky waters like Vaporeon shot back up to stardom. It is very balanced.

The peace was short-lived, as Platinum was released early.



Shaymin Sky: 100 base would have been fine with serene grace, but look at this: 100 / 103 / 75 / 120 / 75 / 127

Seed Flare 2HKOs Calm Max SpDef/Max HP Blissey (80% chance for spdef drop)
I don't need to give any more examples. It gets leaf storm, air slash, growth, quick attack, swords dance, substitute, everything imaginable. It will need uber status.

Now, most would say "Oh, Heatran doesn't need to worry - Choice scarf Eruption".
Wrong
Choice Specs Timid Shaymin outspeeds Heatran and OHKOs with HP Ground (it no longer needs HP Fire or Flying because it has Air Slash for grassers). Though, timid scarftran still cause trouble, Zapdos absorbs anything except HP Ice, Bronzong works the same. Jirachi/Empoleon fare worse, but can survive with special defense investment, and hit back with ice beam or ice punch. Crobat should keep Shaymin at bay with brave bird, sludge bomb, cross poison, hypnosis.





Rotom forms: These all have the same stats, but the forms are not interchangable - that is, if you get lawnmower rotom, it won't learn Hydro Pump. This is unconfirmed, but highly likely. It is also unknown whether they will be of a different second type, or totally different type alotgether.

50 / 50 / 77 / 95 / 77 / 91
vs
50 / 65 / 107 / 105 / 107 / 86


The forms are Lawnmower (grass), Fan (flying), Fridge (ice), Washer (water), Toaster (fire).
The Lawnmower has leaf storm
The fan has air slash
The fridge has blizzard
The toaster has overheat
The washer is unclear - probably water pulse and hydro pump, though

It got a little slower, but the defenses are now massive. Not even funny as to the increase in stats. What is hilarious is how they look.

Definitely OU/BL contenders.




Giratina: Real disappointment, IMO.

150 / 100 / 120 / 100 / 120 / 90
vs
150 / 120 / 100 / 120 / 100 / 90

It really should have gone faster, and a tad less bulky - maybe give that 150 HP stat to speed, and give it base 90 HP. Or at least raise the speed to 125. What really went well with it is the addition of moves - Spite is excellent defenively, and Outrage is for the offensive one. It also learns the very weak Mud Slpa for some reason.
I can't really complain, it needs the defenses in uber

The ability has changed from Pressure to Levitate - as was expected.




So, these are the new pokemon, all great and all. What else has changed?
1.) Salamence now gets Outrage - this is one of the biggest upsets to Dragonite in a long time. IT used to be the sole beholder of DD Outrage, but now...wow.

2.) -Nosepass + Misdreavus lines gets Power Gem
-Bidoof line gets Curse
-Vaporeon gets Muddy Water
-Jolteon gets Discharge
-Flareon gets Lava Plume
-Espeon gets Power Swap
-Umbreon gets Guard Swap
-Leafeon gets Swords Dance by level-up
-Glaceon gets Barrier
-Regigigas gets Foresight, Dizzy Punch, and Revenge
-Sky Shaymin gets Growth, Quick Attack, Air Slash, Sweet Kiss, and Leaf Storm
-Darkrai was bad with Dark Void and CM - it now has Nasty Plot, Ominous Wind, Faint Attack.
-Crappy bugs like Caterpie, Weedle, Burmy, and Combee get Bug Bite. Shuckle also gets it for a power trick. Pineco, Wurmple, Skorupi as well (pineco - a little weird. Forry I understand because it can clamp, but biting?)
-Scizor gets Bullet Punch! (Bullet Punch with Technician, not even life orb or swords dnace boost, does ~72% to average Gengar, ~55% to Azelf; after a swords dance, its an OHKO on T-tar)
-Scyther line gets Feint
-Regis get Stomp
-More new Feint users: Meowth line, Farfetch'd, Kabutops, Skarmory, Sharpedo, Kecleon, Absol, Stunky line, Yanmega (only by breeding previously)
-Tyrogue gets Foresight
-Scyther gets Vacuum Wave
-Onix line gets Curse
-Entei gets Eruption
-Victreebell and bellossom get leaf blade
-
-
-

Some important ones - Bibarel gets curse, so in 3 turns, its a doubled attack, defense, and special defense with amnesia (2 curses + 1 amnesia).

3.) Seed bomb and the elemental punches are likely tutors - the code is a little hard to decipher, but they do seem to be there. Outrage and Hydro Pump as well, seeing as they're in Giratina's learnset, but not level up. Same with Washerotom and Hydro Pump. Leaf Storm looks possible, bu its a little iffy.




Predictions once things get up and running:

Weezing increase - 1 pokemon alone will cause this, and that is the uberfied Scizor. Forgoing Iron Head for bullet punch helps alot, but Weezing survives and fights abck with Fire Blast, WoW, etc.
Steelix willmove out of UU, and move into BL or possibly OU - Curse, STAB Gyro Ball. Okay, BL, but still - no more UU
Probopass will use Power gem. Alot. 105 after STAB, and hitting Fires and Flying Types, as well as buggers.
Jolteon, Aerodactyl, and Crobat - Jolteon not so much, but Aero and Croey rely on Shaymin being OU not uber. They are the only things able to counter it. Aerodactyl has been seeing usage in OU with suicide leads (Aero using SR and proceeding to die).



Ubers:
Dialga: Careful natured Bulk Up max SpDefense max HP sets will be seen alot, to counter Timid Darkrai with NP/Sub/DV/Dark Pulse.
Giratina: Modest/Bold/Timid, with Thunder, Draco Meteor/Dragon Pulse, Calm Mind, Aura Sphere/Rest
Fighting Arceus on the rise.
Scizor will be a monster - X-scissor, STAB Bullet punch, wow...



Discuss...
Author:  Pokemaniac [ Wed Sep 10, 2008 8:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Platinum's Impact on the Metagame
Wow, Darkrai was already a pain in the ass to take out with Dark Void and Calm Mind alone, but now it gets Nasty Plot too? Definitely will be good in ubers but a pain everywhere else. I can imagine Sky Shaymin getting OU status and becoming the Deoxys of that group. I might actually use one of Rotom's new forms because of the more defensive stats now. Giratina's Origin forme is great. Honestly but everything for it seems to be quite rounded out, I mean you don't want to make it "too" good.
Author:  Sav [ Thu Sep 11, 2008 1:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Platinum's Impact on the Metagame
I had no idea those things were rotom's till I read this page, I hope they are all dual ghost types, although even dual with electric would be good (I have always wanted a grass/electric)

I can see Shaymin sky forme beng uber, however some of the new rotoms I think with those defences may reach OU
Author:  tpjerematic [ Thu Sep 11, 2008 2:58 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Platinum's Impact on the Metagame
Its nice to see that they did somthing good with rotom. I like it personally, and it was a shame it was so crappy in DP.

I would think that they will keep the eletric typing over ghost
ele/ghost
ele/water
ele/grass
ele/fire
ele/ice
ele/flying

with the exception of ele/water (lanturn) and ele/flying (zapdos) they are unique

Lol at the washer rotom though.

Shaymin looks like its going to ubers.

Quote:
Scizor gets Bullet Punch! (Bullet Punch with Technician, not even life orb or swords dnace boost, does ~72% to average Gengar, ~55% to Azelf; after a swords dance, its an OHKO on T-tar)
Scizor will be a monster - X-scissor, STAB Bullet punch, wow...


That does look impressive, even from my pathetic knowledge of stats and tiers,
Author:  MasonTheChef [ Thu Sep 11, 2008 3:34 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Platinum's Impact on the Metagame
The chef wants the oven pokemon!! >:O

Personally I think Shaymin's sky forume is gonna be kicked into ubers, air slash + serene grace and those stats O_o..

The rotoms are all gonna be BL at least, OU if some of the forumes keep levitate. defensive wise it's only ok, 50 base HP dampers that.

Giratina and Salamence: Why more outrage users D: I have a feeling salamence is going to become the new garchomp.

-Bidoof might now have a niche as a good curse tank esp. w/ simple 8-) 1 turn to double both atk. and def. and 1 turn to up s.def 300%

-Vaporeon is gonna have better type coverage

-I feel sorry for flareon :lol:

-Esp/Umb's swaps can be intresting to use, but won't

-Darkari is now a jerk uber.. at least it's frail

-Scizor is OU in the OU as it is... at least it's a steel type priority

-Victrebell might get more UU use w/ leaf blade

Outrage as a tutor move... .....
Author:  EvilPenguin [ Thu Sep 11, 2008 4:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Platinum's Impact on the Metagame
GOGO LAWNMOWER <3

Yeah, sky shaymin is uber for sure, no question.

For Rotom, it depends, if the types switch, I could see the fridge being OU (STAB on boltbeam with decent SA, for chrissake), as well as maybe the oven if it has Levitate - nice defense with only two weaks, plus an eq immune and a 4x resist to steel (steelix, bronzong, etc say hi)

Bibarel is BL now, theres no way it isn't

Why the hell does GF hate Flareon so much? At least Entei got a high powered STAB move that it could probably possibly sortakinda use, maybe. Screw it, just give them stinking Flare Blitz already D:

Salamence is going to be a pain D:

Its a bit of a stretch, but dizzy punch could be helpful to regigiggitygas for waiting out slow start. It really wants Dynamicpunch though. Or Skill swap :P
Author:  Jeneus [ Fri Sep 12, 2008 5:05 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Platinum's Impact on the Metagame
I like the Fridge form!! I hope that it'll be ghost. ->

Ghost= 5 weaknesses
Electric w/ levitate= 2....

Nevermind! Let's make it electric
Author:  Peanut-Lover [ Fri Sep 12, 2008 5:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Platinum's Impact on the Metagame
Something tells me and the other people I was discussing with regarding the compatability issues that Rotom is just Electric/Ghost with Levitate.

It is unclear if you can switch between forms, but its looking more and mroe like that - change to frost, change back to original, change to toaster.

There is probably a flare blitz tutor, but flareon doesn't have the move programmed for it. I loled. Then again, the flare blitz code is very similar to alot of other moves, so thats questionable.



Edit: Rotom has the ability to hold two items in DP - one would be the form item, the other will be a normal item. It is unclear if it could hold two regular items and be a normal form.

Edit 2: Giratina Origin is incompatable over WiFi battles with DP. The item to keep it origin (the platinum orb) was never coded for in DP.

Is it possible that the Rotom forms are the same?
Author:  Frost [ Fri Sep 12, 2008 8:24 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Platinum's Impact on the Metagame
EvilPenguin wrote:
Bibarel is BL now, theres no way it isn't

Uh... no.

Curse helps Bibarel a lot, but I think you're overestimating it. It's good that his STAB types are nearly unresisted and that it can essentially use Swords Dance and Iron Defense at the same time, but it's still slow and fragile. It has mediocre HP and half of your EVs will be spent pumping that stat up to a blah max 362. Pseudohazing still screws it over hard because its Speed is being halved with every Curse as well. It has to survive Special attacks if it Curses or physical attacks if it uses Amnesia.

In other words, it can't boost everything at the same time and that's not helpful when your original Defenses are base 60 (and since 252 EVs are blown in HP, you have the remaining 256 to pour in some combination of Attack and the two Defenses, making it unlikely that Bibarel will ever have max Defenses). Even if it can somehow get off two Curses and an Amnesia without dying, it still doesn't have recovery outside out of Wish support or Leftovers. Still, it does go a fair way in making Bibarel actually usable. Yay for Gamefreak helping out suckier Pokemon.

To be honest, I'm pretty pissed that Salamence got Outrage. Way to make Dragonite obsolete for the umpteenth time, Gamefreak. And even though Flareon may have picked up Superpower, the fact that they gave it Lava Plume (rather than Flare Blitz) is just further kicking sand into its face. I'm convinced that Flareon ate a staff member's family or something. However, the idea that Shaymin will actually become viable if it picks up Air Slash via Skymin excites me. :3

Also, Muddy Water is a Water attack, so it really doesn't affect Vaporeon's coverage at all.
Author:  sanjay120 [ Fri Sep 12, 2008 12:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Platinum's Impact on the Metagame
I'd like to point out that it is unconfirmed if the Rotom types change typing at all, and they are interchangeable, so you could get Blizzard from fridge, Leaf Storm from lawnmower, Overheat from toaster, Air Slash from fan, and Hydro Pump from washing machine and change back to normal forme for a specs set. The new formes have pretty much Spiritomb's defensive stats with an attack loss and a Spd/SAttk increase, so I'm seeing BL for them.

And Outrage Mence I can't see becoming a seriously broken problem. It's not Garchomp. Remember the things we used to use to counter Chomp before Yache Berry was discovered? Those work for Mence now. Cressy, Suicune, Bronzong, Slowbro, Starmie, hell Metagross because it can take non-STAB EQ. They're all good. Dragon Dance is not Swords Dance, it will have to get rid of Yache for Garchomp's power.

What you all should be worried about are Outrage Kingdra, TPunch/Ice Punch Lucario, and Bullet Punch Scizor.

Quote:
Edit: Rotom has the ability to hold two items in DP - one would be the form item, the other will be a normal item.


Source please, because I've been hearing that you use an item to change its forms in certain rooms, and I can't see you having to go to Old Chateau, then give it an item, then leave for it to transform.
Author:  Peanut-Lover [ Fri Sep 12, 2008 2:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Platinum's Impact on the Metagame
1.) Salamence is in certain ways more dangerous than Garchomp, as it has Dragon Dance to prevent revenge-killing.
2.) Source for Rotom: http://lolstop/platinum/forms.shtml (yes, its Serebii, but they have extracted the data. ALOT)
"Rotom is unique in the ability to possess multiple items".

Regardless of how it is done using the secret key...it can possess multiple items.

3.) MASSIVE UPDATES, courtesy of Jigglypuff for level up, but I didn't see tutors, so I referred to other sites for those.

The move tutors are found in 3 places - They appear to be infinite use, but you need to trade shards now.

Code:
Pastoria Move Tutor (found on Route 212): Dive, Fury Cutter, Icy Wind, Thunder Punch, Fire Punch, Ice Punch, Ominous Wind, Air Cutter, Zen Headbutt, Vacuum Wave, Trick, Knock Off, Sucker Punch

Snowpoint Move Tutor (found in the North East section of Snowpoint City): Snore, Spite, Helping Hand, Synthesis, Magnet Rise, Last Resort, Swift, Uproar

The third Move Tutor is in the Survival Area. He teaches Mud-Slap, Rollout, Superpower, Iron Head, Aqua Tail, Gastro Acid, Wring Out, Outrage, Ancientpower, Signal Beam, Earth Power, Gunk Shot, Twister, Seed Bomb, Iron Defense, Bounce, and Heat Wave.


And the winners of these tutors (not all are listed, sorry). These are in ABC order based on move:
Pokemon that have tutor testing finished:

Abomasnow: Ice Punch, Icy Wind, Mud-slap, Outrage, Seed Bomb
Absol: Mud Slap, Super Power, Bounce, Fury Cutter, Icy Wind, Zen Headbutt, Knock Off, Sucker Punch
Aerodactyl: Ominous Wind, Air Cutter, Iron Head, Aqua Tail, Ancientpower, Earth Power, Twister, Heat Wave
Aggron: Ice Punch, Thunder Punch, Fire Punch, Fury Cutter, Icy Wind, Mud-slap, Rollout, Superpower, Iron Head, Aqua Tail, Endeavor, Outrage, Ancientpower, Earth Power, Iron Defense
Alakazam: Fire Punch, Ice Punch, Thunder Punch, Zen Headbutt, Trick, Knock Off, Signal Beam
Altaria: Mud Slap, Outrage, Twister, Heat Wave, Air Cutter, Ominous Wind
Ambipom: Fire Punch, Ice Punch, ThunderPunch, Fury Cutter, Knock Off, Mud-slap, Gunk Shot, Seed Bomb, Bounce
Ampharos: Fire Punch, ThunderPunch, Outrage, Signal Beam, Magnet Rise
Arbok: Aqua Tail, Gastro Acid, Gunk Shot, Seed Bomb
Arcanine: Mud Slap, Iron Head, Heat Wave
Arceus: Dive, Fury Cutter, Icy Wind, Ominous Wind, Zen Headbutt, Trick, Mud-slap, Iron Head, Aqua Tail, Outrage, Ancientpower, Signal Beam, Earth Power, Twister, Iron Defense, Heat Wave
Ariados: Sucker Punch, Signal Beam, Bounce
Armaldo: Fury Cutter, Knock Off, Mud-slap, Superpower, Aqua Tail, Ancientpower, Earth Power, Iron Defense
Articuno: Icy Wind, Ominous Wind, Air Cutter, Mud-slap, Ancientpower, Signal Beam, Twister
Azelf: Zen Headbutt, Mud Slap, Signal Beam, Ice Punch, Thunder Punch, Fire Punch, Trick, Knock Off
Azumarill: Dive, Icy Wind, Ice Punch, Knock Off, Mud-slap, Rollout, Superpower, Aqua Tail
Bastiodon: Mud-slap, Iron Head, Outrage, Ancientpower, Earth Power, Iron Defense
Beautifly: Ominous Wind, Air Cutter, Signal Beam, Twister
Beedrill: Endeavor, Fury Cutter, Ominous Wind, Air Cutter, Knock Off
Bellossom: Gastro Acid, Seed Bomb
Bibarel: Mud-slap, Rollout, Superpower, Aqua Tail, Dive, Fury Cutter, Icy Wind
Blastoise: Mud-slap, Rollout, Aqua Tail, Outrage, Signal Beam, Iron Defense, Dive, Icy Wind, Ice Punch, Zen Headbutt
Blaziken: Mud-slap, Superpower, Bounce, Heat Wave, Fury Cutter, Thunder Punch, Fire Punch, Vacuum Wave, Knock Off
Blissey: Mud-slap, Rollout, Endeavor, Icy Wind, Thunder Punch, Fire Punch, Ice Punch, Zen Headbutt
Breloom: Fury Cutter, Thunder Punch, Vacuum Wave, Mud-slap, Superpower, Seed Bomb
Bronzong: Rollout, Iron Head, Ancientpower, Signal Beam, Zen Headbutt, Trick
Cacturne: Mud-slap, Superpower, Seed Bomb, Snore, Spite, Synthesis, Fury Cutter, ThunderPunch, Sucker Punch
Camerupt: Mud-slap, Rollout, Iron Head, Earth Power, Heat Wave, Snore
Carnivine: Mud-slap, Gastro Acid, Seed Bomb, Snore, Synthesis, Fury Cutter, Knock Off
Castform: Snore, Last Resort, Swift, Icy Wind, Ominous Wind
Celebi: Mud Slap, Ancient Power, Signal Beam, Earth Power, Seed Bomb, Zen Headbutt, Trick
Charizard: Mud-slap, Outrage, Twister, Heat Wave, Snore, Swift, Fury Cutter, Thunder Punch, Fire Punch, Ominous Wind, Air Cutter
Chatot: Mud-slap, Twister, Heat Wave, Snore, Swift, Uproar, Ominous Wind
Cherrim: Rollout, Seed Bomb, Snore, Helping Hand, Synthesis
Chimecho: Rollout, Signal Beam, Snore, Helping Hand, Last Resort, Uproar, Icy Wind, Zen Headbutt, Trick, Knock Off
Claydol: Mud-slap, Ancientpower, Signal Beam, Earth Power, Zen Headbutt, Trick
Clefable: Mud Slap, Rollout, Endeavor, Signal Beam, Bounce, Icy Wind, Thunder Punch, Fire Punch, Ice Punch, Zen Headbutt, Trick, Knock Off
Cloyster: Signal Beam, Iron Defense, Snore, Swift, Dive, Icy Wind
Corsola: Icy Wind, Sucker Punch, Mud-slap, Rollout, Endeavor, Ancientpower, Earth Power, Snore
Cradily: Mud-slap, Gastro Acid, Ancientpower, Earth Power, Seed Bomb, Snore, Synthesis
Crawdaunt: Dive, Fury Cutter, Icy Wind, Knock Off, Mud-slap, Superpower, Endeavor, Ancientpower, Iron Defense, Snore, Spite, Swift
Cresselia: Snore, Helping Hand, Swift, Fury Cutter, Icy Wind, Zen Headbutt, Trick, Signal Beam, Mud Slap
Crobat: Ominous Wind, Air Cutter, Zen Headbutt, Twister, Heat Wave, Snore, Swift, Uproar
Delcatty: Icy Wind, Zen Headbutt, Sucker Punch, Mud-slap, Rollout
Delibird: Icy Wind, Mud-slap, Rollout, Signal Beam, Gunk Shot, Seed Bomb, Bounce, Swift
Deoxys: Icy Wind, Ice Punch, Thunder Punch, Fire Punch, Zen Headbutt, Trick, Knock Off, Mud-slap, Signal Beam, Snore, Swift
Dewgong: Dive, Icy Wind, Aqua Tail, Signal Beam, Snore
Dialga: Fury Cutter, Mud-slap, Iron Head, Earth Power, Ancientpower, Iron Defense, Twister, Outrage, Snore, Magnet Rise, Swift
Dodrio: Air Cutter, Knock Off, Mud-slap, Endeavor, Snore, Swift, Uproar
Donphan: Knock Off, Mud-slap, Rollout, Superpower, Ancientpower, Earth Power, Gunk Shot, Seed Bomb, Iron Defense, Bounce, Snore
Dragonite: Dive, Fury Cutter, Icy Wind, Ice Punch, Thunder Punch, Fire Punch, Ominous Wind, Air Cutter, Mud-slap, Superpower, Iron Tail, Aqua Tail, Outrage, Twister, Heat Wave, Snore, Swift
Drifblim: Mud Slap, Rollout, Icy Wind, Ominous Wind, Air Cutter, Trick, Knock Off, Sucker Punch
Dugtrio: Sucker Punch, Snore, Mud Slap, Earth Power
Dunsparce: Zen Headbutt, Mud-slap, Rollout, Aqua Tail, Endeavor, Ancientpower, Snore, Spite, Last Resort
Dusknoir: Mud Slap, Icy Wind, Thunder Punch, Ice Punch, Fire Punch, Ominous Wind, Trick, Sucker Punch
Dustox: Ominous Wind, Air Cutter, Snore, Swift, Signal Beam, Twister
Entei: Mud Slap, Iron Head, Heat Wave
Exeggutor: Rollout, Ancientpower, Seed Bomb, Zen Headbutt
Flareon: Mud-slap, Superpower, Heat Wave
Floatzel: Dive, Icy Wind, Ice Punch, Mud-slap, Aqua Tail
Forretress: Rollout, Signal Beam, Iron Defense, Snore, Magnet Rise
Hariyama: Mud-slap, Superpower, Iron Head, Fire Punch, Ice Punch, Thunder Punch, Vacuum Wave, Knock Off
Jirachi: Thunder Punch, Fire Punch, Ice Punch, Zen Headbutt, Mud Slap, Ancient Power, Trick, Iron Head, Iron Defense, Signal Beam, Icy Wind
Jynx: Mud Slap, Signal Beam, Icy Wind, Ice Punch, Zen Headbutt, Trick
Kingler: Dive, Fury Cutter, Icy Wind, Knock Off, Mud-slap, Superpower, Ancientpower, Iron Defense, Snore
Lapras: Dive, Icy Wind, Zen Headbutt, Iron Head, Aqua Tail, Outrage, Ancientpower, Signal Beam
Lopunny: Fury Cutter, Ice Punch, Thunder Punch, Fire Punch, Mud-slap, Endeavor, Bounce
Ludicolo: Mud-slap, Seed Bomb, Fire Punch, Ice Punch, Thunder Punch, Dive, Icy Wind, Zen Headbutt
Machamp: Ice Punch, Thunder Punch, Fire Punch, Vacuum Wave, Mud-slap, Superpower
Magmortar: Mud-slap, Heat Wave, Fire Punch, Thunder Punch
Magnezone: Snore, Magnet Rise, Swift, Rollout, Iron Head, Signal Beam, Iron Defense
Mamoswine: Mud Slap, Superpower, Earth Power, Ancient Power, Endeavor, Icy Wind
Masquerain: Mud-slap, Signal Beam, Twister, Icy Wind, Ominous Wind, Air Cutter
Medicham: Fire Punch, Ice Punch, Thunder Punch, Zen Headbutt, Vacuum Wave, Trick, Snore, Helping Hand, Swift, Mud Slap, Signal Beam
Meganium: Mud Slap, Outrage, Ancient Power, Seed Bomb, Fury Cutter
Mewtwo: Snore, Swift, Icy Wind, Thunder Punch, Fire Punch, Ice Punch, Zen Headbutt, Trick, Mud Slap, Aqua Tail, Signal Beam
Milotic: Snore, Swift, Icy Wind, Dive, Mud Slap, Aqua Tail, Iron Head, Twister
Miltank: Snore, Helping Hand, Icy Wind, Thunder Punch, Ice Punch, Fire Punch, Zen Headbutt, Mud Slap, Rollout, Iron Head
Moltres: Ominous Wind, Air Cutter, Snore, Swift, Mud Slap, Ancientpower, Twister, Heat Wave
Palkia: Mud Slap, Aqua Tail, Outrage, Earth Power, Ancient Power, Twister
Pelliper: Air Cutter, Ominous Wind, Icy Wind, Knock Off, Snore, Swift, Uproar, Mud Slap, Gunk Shot, Twister, Seed Bomb
Persian: Icy Wind, Knock Off, Mud-slap, Gunk Shot, Seed Bomb
Pidgeot: Ominous Wind, Air Cutter, Snore, Swift, Uproar, Mud Slap, Twister, Heat Wave
Poliwrath: Dive, Icy Wind, Ice Punch, Vacuum Wave, Mud-slap
Raichu: Thunder Punch, Knock Off, Mud-slap, Rollout, Signal Beam
Rampardos: Thunder Punch, Fire Punch, Zen Headbutt, Mud-slap, Superpower, Iron Head, Endeavor, Outrage, Ancientpower, Earth Power
Rapidash: Bounce, Heat Wave
Roserade: Fury Cutter, Snore, Swift, Mud Slap, Seed Bomb
Rotom: Snore, Spite, Swift Uproar, Ominous Wind, Trick, Sucker Punch, Mud Slap, Signal Beam
Salamence: Mud-slap, Rollout, Aqua Tail, Outrage, Twister, Heat Wave, Fury Cutter, Ominous Wind, Air Cutter, Zen Headbutt
Sandslash: Fury Cutter, Knock Off, Mud-slap, Rollout, Earth Power, Snore, Swift
Shedinja: Mud-slap, Fury Cutter, Trick, Sucker Punch
Skarmory: Mud-slap, Twister, Iron Defense, Fury Cutter, Icy Wind, Ominous Wind, Air Cutter
Steelix: Mud-slap, Rollout, Iron Head, Aqua Tail, Ancientpower, Earth Power, Twister, Snore, Magnet Rise
Swellow: Snore, Swift, Air Cutter, Ominous Wind, Mud Slap, Endeavor, Twister, Heat Wave
Tentacruel: Dive, Icy Wind, Knock Off, Snore
Typhlosion: Fury Cutter, Fire Punch, Thunder Punch, Mud-slap, Rollout, Heat Wave
Tyranitar: Fire Punch, Ice Punch, Thunder Punch, Fury Cutter, Mud-slap, Superpower, Iron Head, Aqua Tail, Outrage, Ancientpower, Earth Power
Venomoth: Signal Beam, Twister, Air Cutter, Zen Headbutt, Ominous Wind
Victreebel: Knock Off, Sucker Punch, Gastro Acid, Seed Bomb
Vileplume: Gastro Acid, Seed Bomb
Walrein: Mud-slap, Rollout, Iron Head, Aqua Tail, Signal Beam, Dive, Fury Cutter, Icy Wind
Weavile: Mud-slap, Fury Cutter, Icy Wind, Ice Punch, Knock Off
Zapdos: Ominous Wind, Air Cutter, Snore, Swift, Mud Slap, Ancientpower, Signal Beam, Twister, Heat Wave

Those omitted fall under one of the following categories...
1.) They are of earlir evolution (ie, wingull vs Pelipper)
2.) It has not been fully determined yet. ie, Shaymin has land power, but thats all we know.



You think thats alot? There are Level up additions as well. Surprisingly few, these are:
Code:
Level Up Move Additions:
008 Wartortle: Lv 40 Iron Defense
009 Blastoise: Lv 46 Iron Defense
010 Caterpie: Lv 15 Bug Bite
013 Weedle: Lv 15 Bug Bite
052 Meowth: Lv 54 Feint
053 Persian: Lv 68 Feint
055 Golduck: Lv -- Aqua Jet
071 Victreebel: Lv 47 Leaf Blade
083 Farfetch'd: Lv 43 Feint
095 Onix: Lv 38 Curse
123 Scyther: Lv -- Vacuum Wave
123 Scyther: Lv 61 Feint
134 Vaporeon: Lv 78 Muddy Water
135 Jolteon: Lv 78 Discharge
136 Flareon: Lv 78 Lava Plume
141 Kabutops: Lv -- Feint
158 Totodile: Lv 22 Flail
159 Croconaw: Lv 24 Flail
160 Feraligatr: Lv 24 Flail
163 Hoothoot: Lv 13 Uproar
164 Noctowl: Lv 13 Uproar
182 Belossom: Lv -- Leaf Blade
186 Politoed: Lv 48 Hyper Voice
196 Espeon: Lv 78 Power Swap
197 Umbreon: Lv 78 Guard Swap
199 Slowking: Lv -- Power Gem
200 Misdreavus: Lv 50 Power Gem
204 Pineco: Lv 9 Bug Bite
205 Forrtress: Lv --, 9 Bug Bite
208 Steelix: Lv 38 Curse
212 Scizor: Lv -- Bullet Punch
212 Scizor: Lv 61 Feint
213 Shuckle: Lv 40 Bug Bite
227 Skarmory: Lv 20 Feint
236 Tyrouge: Lv -- Foresight
243 Raikou: Lv 71 Rain Dance >_>
244 Entei: Lv 85 Eruption
245 Suicune: Lv 85 Blizzard <_<
265 Wurmple: Lv 15 Bug Bite
270 Lotad: Lv 25 Bubblebeam
271 Lombre: Lv 25 Bubblebeam
299 Nosepass: Lv 49 Power Gem
300 Skitty: Lv 4 Foresight
319 Sharpedo: Lv -- Feint
352 Kecleon: Lv 14 Feint
359 Absol: Lv -- Feint
377 Regirock: Lv -- Stomp
378 Regice: Lv -- Stomp
379 Registeel: Lv -- Stomp
399 Bidoof: Lv 45 Curse
400 Bibarel: Lv 53 Curse
401 Kricketot: Lv 16 Bug Bite
402 Kricketune: Lv 26 Slash
402 Kricketune: Lv 38 Taunt
402 Kricketune: Lv 42 Night Slash
412 Burmy: Lv 15 Bug Bite
413 Wormadam (All Forms): Lv 15 Bug Bite
414 Mothim: Lv 15 Bug Bite
415 Combee: Lv 13 Bug Bite
434 Stunky: Lv 18 Feint
435 Skuntank: Lv 18 Feint
451 Skorupi: Lv 34 Bug Bite
452 Drapion: Lv 34 Bug Bite
469 Yanmega: Lv 38 Feint
470 Leafeon: Lv 78 Swords Dance
471 Glaceon: Lv 78 Barrier
476 Probopass: Lv 49 Power Gem
480 Uxie: Lv 21 Swift
481 Mesprit: Lv 21 Swift
482 Azelf: Lv 21 Swift
486 Regigias: Lv -- Dizzy Punch
486 Reigigas: Lv -- Foresight
486 Regigias: Lv 25 Revenge
491 Darkrai: Lv -- Ominous Wind
491 Darkrai: Lv 29 Faint Attack
491 Darkrai: Lv 75 Nasty Plot
492 Shaymin (Both Formes): Lv -- Growth
492 Shaymin (Both Formes): Lv 82 Sweet Kiss
492 Shaymin (Land Forme): Lv 91 Healing Wish
492 Shaymin (Sky Forme): Lv 28 Quick Attack
492 Shaymin (Sky Forme): Lv 64 Air Slash
492 Shaymin (Sky Forme): Lv 91 Leaf Storm
Author:  pokemonrox96 [ Fri Sep 12, 2008 5:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Platinum's Impact on the Metagame
the palt game i am itching 2 have come out, but all these changes are cool as well as a pain in the pooper. :lol:
Author:  Jeneus [ Sat Sep 13, 2008 6:09 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Platinum's Impact on the Metagame
I Know! I'm so excited even though I don't have enough money to buy it!!! :mrgreen:
Author:  sanjay120 [ Sat Sep 13, 2008 6:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Platinum's Impact on the Metagame
Quote:
Source for Rotom: http://lolstop/platinum/forms.shtml (yes, its Serebii, but they have extracted the data. ALOT)


That doesn't claim Rotom can hold two items. Secret Key is most likely either a key item or a one-use item like the evolution stones.

Salamence may be harder to revenge kill but it's much easier to wall.
Author:  Boeing-Flygon707 [ Sun Sep 14, 2008 6:31 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Platinum's Impact on the Metagame
If Shaymin won't be uber, it will replace togekiss with the flinching matter, maybe, but togekiss will still be in.
Author:  sanjay120 [ Sun Sep 14, 2008 2:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Platinum's Impact on the Metagame
Togekiss is bulkier and knows TWave, I'm sure it will have a niche.

Though Skymin can Subseed...
Author:  Peanut-Lover [ Sun Sep 14, 2008 2:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Platinum's Impact on the Metagame
According to some people on Smogon, Skymin is not usable over Wifi. Further testing is still being done, but we're not entirely sure.

In other news, Pokebeach and serebii have more info on rotom, but follow closely.

When you get the secret key, you will be able to open a door in a house in eterna city. In there are 5 items - a fridge, a washer, a lanmower, a fan, and a toaster. Go up to any of them, select a, and rotom will mix with the machine's motor. It will then gain the special move (overheat, hydro pump, etc), and will keep that move until it is feed from the machine.

Aside from the one move, there is no difference between them in respect to the learnsets.
If you have more than one Rotom, feel free to control more than one appliance.

Species clause: In regular battle, it is likely that two rotoms of different forms will be banned, as it is still 2 Rotoms. In the fronteir, you can use two different rotoms, but not two rotoms of th same form.


EDIT: SHAYMIN NO LONGER NEEDS HP GROUND - SAY HELLO TO EARTH POWER, HEATRAN!!!!!!

Edit: Togekiss lacks the HP, thats a tad bit of a problem. But yes, it is more bulky.
Author:  Prof. Dom [ Mon Sep 15, 2008 11:59 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Platinum's Impact on the Metagame
I wish I waited to soft reset for my Darkrai. What use is a Modest Darkrai now.
and I wish I traded over my last Rotom now that they can do SOMETHING.
It seems that Platinum will do much more than Emerald did, which I didn't think it would.
Dissappointed by Salamence filling Garchomp's void though, what is the point of Dragonite?

I can't wait. (:
Author:  sanjay120 [ Mon Sep 15, 2008 4:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Platinum's Impact on the Metagame
A Sucker Punch is not a literal punch. It's a sneak attack.

I don't see why Rotom's formes would fall under species clause in a competitive battle. They're distinguishable from one another, which is the main problem people have with species clause in the first place.

Skymin is usable over link battles. Serebii has a screenshot of it in a Wifi battle but as of now no one knows how to make it work.

The point of Dragonite is to OHKO Blissey with Superpower and be a great wall breaker. It can also support. It's not dead yet.
Author:  MasonTheChef [ Mon Sep 15, 2008 7:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Platinum's Impact on the Metagame
sanjay120 wrote:
A Sucker Punch is not a literal punch. It's a sneak attack.

I don't see why Rotom's formes would fall under species clause in a competitive battle. They're distinguishable from one another, which is the main problem people have with species clause in the first place.

Skymin is usable over link battles. Serebii has a screenshot of it in a Wifi battle but as of now no one knows how to make it work.

The point of Dragonite is to OHKO Blissey with Superpower and be a great wall breaker. It can also support. It's not dead yet.



Ah, you caught my post before/while I was deleting it. Well, it still says punch in the name :lol: So hitmonchan should gain a 20% boost on it, then combine that with bullet and mach punches and you have a un-resisted priority moveset. (add CC in there to OHKO bliss, lax and 50%-60% of skarm.)

I guess the tutor list aren't complete yet, so I'll wait to complain.


Oooo Trick on Clefable :twisted:
Author:  Frost [ Mon Sep 15, 2008 8:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Platinum's Impact on the Metagame
Things such as movepools and how various moves interact with Pokemon and abilities are determined by the Japanese names of the moves. This is why Ampharos doesn't get Tail Glow, because the name of the attack in Japan is Firefly Light, and why Iron Fist boosts Meteor Mash (which is called Comet Punch in Japan) but not Sucker Punch (which is called Ambush in Japan). It's almost certain that Iron Fist will never boost Sucker Punch unless the game gets reprogrammed for international release, and that isn't likely.
Author:  Peanut-Lover [ Mon Sep 15, 2008 10:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Platinum's Impact on the Metagame
Wait, but wasn't comet punch already an english move?


Anyway, more tutors are being deciphered. I just posted a Shaymin thread.

Just posting an answer:
Quote:
I don't see why Rotom's formes would fall under species clause in a competitive battle. They're distinguishable from one another, which is the main problem people have with species clause in the first place.


Same dex entry = violation of species clause.
Author:  koipen [ Tue Sep 16, 2008 4:48 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Platinum's Impact on the Metagame
The Rotom forms would be maybe a special Spiritomb? more weaknesess ad Resistances, which is fair with Tomb. It has better SpAtt than Tombs Att, and it could also use Trick... I think that Rotom is a lot better with it's new formes.
Author:  MasonTheChef [ Tue Sep 16, 2008 11:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Platinum's Impact on the Metagame
Frost wrote:
Things such as movepools and how various moves interact with Pokemon and abilities are determined by the Japanese names of the moves. This is why Ampharos doesn't get Tail Glow, because the name of the attack in Japan is Firefly Light, and why Iron Fist boosts Meteor Mash (which is called Comet Punch in Japan) but not Sucker Punch (which is called Ambush in Japan). It's almost certain that Iron Fist will never boost Sucker Punch unless the game gets reprogrammed for international release, and that isn't likely.


O_o aww, that sucks... still hoping for him to be tutored-able for it.
Author:  Frost [ Tue Sep 16, 2008 2:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Platinum's Impact on the Metagame
Peanut-Lover wrote:
Wait, but wasn't comet punch already an english move?

Yes... what's your point? Our Comet Punch is known as Consecutive Punch in Japan.
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